The reader will have to take my word that this person I will quote at length below is a "Leftist" and an atheist. He's a chatter at Paltalk, an admin in the room "Uncensored Religion Debate", and goes by the nickname "nontheist primate" (a clear indication of his atheist beliefs). He has been participating in that chat room (as have I) for years and years.
As a Leftist and atheist, it has been unsurprising to me that nontheist primate has tended to spend most of his time picking at Christianity, meanwhile whitewashing Islam. I did once or twice notice him saying disparaging things about Islam, but on occasions that seemed to me few and far between.
This is why it is all the more remarkable how he interrogated a Muslima of the room -- one "Kid DJ", a female American convert to Islam and another admin of the room as well. For what seemed to be a good two hours, nontheist primate held Kid DJ's feet to the fire and would not let go as he continued to insist, and persist, in getting her to stop tap-dancing and simply answer his questions. The particular issue at the center of their tête-à-tête was the Islamic teaching, through their Bukhari hadiths, that Muhammad married Aisha when she was age 6 and consummated that marriage (i.e., raped her) when she was age 9. The Muslima in the chat room, Kid DJ, apparently was trying to argue that many Muslims believe Aisha was much older when Mohammed married her -- to which nontheist primate asked her for evidence of this claim, and Kid DJ proceeded to tap-dance around his simple request for what seemed to be hours, never providing evidence for her claim. Meanwhile the evidence for the opposing claim is found in the most authoritative compilation of hadiths, by Bukhari -- volume 5, book 58, number 236):
"...he [Mohammed] married 'Aisha when she was a girl of six years of age, and he consumed [sic; meaning "consummated"] that marriage when she was nine years old.
Here follows all the relevant quotes from nontheist primate in that exchange. I don't have the text of Kid DJ because I was ignoring her (making her text not visible to me). But one doesn't need to see her text to clearly see what she was doing, as it becomes evident from nontheist primate's text.
[Notes: "Tia" = Kid DJ; the reader will notice our old friend "The Big W" makes an appearance twice, to add important points along the way; and the "malik" referenced by nontheist primate is one of the great Muslim commentators who founded one of the 4 Schools of Islamic law]
nontheist-primate [10:49 PM]
so do you have the malik writings about her age?
nontheist-primate [10:50 PM]
why would it take a while to research if you are so sure it's there?
nontheist-primate [10:50 PM]
that makes no sense
nontheist-primate [10:51 PM]
why would finding first millenium scholars who think Aisha was postpubescent be hard? could it be because it's not the correct view? could it be those closest to her and the religion back then DID NOT THINK THAT?
nontheist-primate [10:51 PM] that's entirely my point. when it is found, it's famous. so if it's hard to find, why would that be?
nontheist-primate [10:52 PM] Tia - you made the claim though that malik DID speak to her age
nontheist-primate [10:52 PM] yes, yes it is what you said I asked you did malik speak to aisha's age and you said yes.
nontheist-primate [10:53 PM] Yes, yes it is. You did say yes after I asked you if malik spoke to aisha's age. it was typed. no mishearing
nontheist-primate [10:53 PM] ok so you have one guy that doesn't accept the entire hadiths... but does he speak to Aisha's age?
nontheist-primate [10:55 PM] no it seems like deception on yours. I spoke only of first millenia scholars. I spoke of only original muslims yeah it's interesting to expose deception in you Tia. I was not talking about any youtube video. I insistently persisted on ONLY ancient men. Scholars from mohammed's time
nontheist-primate [10:56 PM] he was who I was asking you about
nontheist-primate [10:56 PM] a first millenium scholar?
nontheist-primate [10:57 PM] you're misrepresenting me and telling me that I'm misunderstanding.
nontheist-primate [10:57 PM] I'm surprised you're doing this to be honest too.
nontheist-primate [10:58 PM] it's not a misunderstanding. I asked a simple question based on a line of questions and YOU are deceptively answering about a DIFFERENT PERSON thinking it's who I was talking about.
nontheist-primate [10:58 PM] You deceptively answered yes when I asked you about that. now you're changing your stance because you have no evideence[SIC]. denying a hadith is not speaking to age. so that's just a failed argument.
nontheist-primate [10:59 PM] I expeced [SIC] more from you, Tia.
nontheist-primate [10:59 PM] this is sad.
nontheist-primate [11:00 PM] I was very clear with my line of questioning. I ONLY spoke of first century people
nontheist-primate [11:00 PM] you answered my question about a CURRENT person. that's deceptive.
nontheist-primate [11:00 PM] so YOU misunderstood.
nontheist-primate [11:00 PM] I have all the text. I read it again. You are the one who is answering questions incorrectly and misleading.
nontheist-primate [11:00 PM] I don't have a misunderstanding.
nontheist-primate [11:01 PM] you do.
nontheist-primate [11:01 PM] so you have no first millenium scholar
nontheist-primate [11:01 PM] that's how you misled me.
nontheist-primate [11:02 PM] you misled me by changing the person. my question was during a line of questions. Anybody who is honest would know I was speaking of a first century scholar. your position has no weight. anybody defending islam usually is deceptive.
nontheist-primate [11:03 PM] I ONLY mentioned early scholars. bottom line is you have nothing to show aisha wasn't a little girl.
nontheist-primate [11:03 PM] no there isn't. there's no evidence that shows she's older. you just literally said that.
nontheist-primate [11:04 PM] I've already explained how that's a failed argument.
thebig_W [11:04 PM] Kid DJ wouldn't even know about Aisha if it weren't for the Sunna she pretends to reject
nontheist-primate [11:04 PM] reasonable people don't accept islam.
nontheist-primate [11:05 PM] tia, please stop lying. [11:05 PM] please
nontheist-primate the fact that you have nothing but failed arguments and lies is just disgusting.
nontheist-primate [11:06 PM] you can post the evidence of your deception. have fun with that.
nontheist-primate [11:06 PM] I'm making an effort to figure out why you're misrepresenting me. and my questions.
nontheist-primate [11:06 PM] you were honest until tonight.
nontheist-primate [11:07 PM] but until tonight I didn't question you on mohammed's pedophilia.
nontheist-primate [11:07 PM] Tia - I have already read it.
nontheist-primate [11:07 PM] the point is that you have no reason to think aisha wasn't a little girl.
thebig_W [11:07 PM] now nontheist knows about the principle of "A Muslim is Moderate until they are questioned with follow-up questions”
nontheist-primate [11:21 PM] ok, that's it. Game over. You're done Tia.
nontheist-primate [11:21 PM] bye bye.
nontheist-primate [11:22 PM]] : pity that Tia was exposed as a liar tonight.
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